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- Fellow PM.Dip
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Hi
I downloaded the Moneysoft Payroll Manager for a little practice using the mock payroll management exam.
NB: Am trying to keep costs down and this is how I got through Level II Bookkeeping exam. Am using all the notes on NIC, taxes etc, from HMRC too.
The problem I am finding is that 95% of the time, the NIC deductions are 5p short every week and no tax/NIC adjustments are made from the employee on holiday until the week he returns.
Am I missing something as I have been over and over this many times. All the details seem to be correct in respect of the individual employees, ie. NI table letter, etc.
Help before I start pulling out what hair I have left.  
Thanks in advance.
David
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Hi David
Havent had a chance to look at NIC for you but the holiday bit rung a bell straight away
Go into the calendar tab, click on settings on top bar - this brings up employer/employee terms, click onto holidays and untick 'show holidays in following week' (I think thats what you are talking about anyway?? - bit late for me tonight :-( )
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- Fellow PM.Dip
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Hi Liz
Thanks for the reply, I see you used Moneysoft for the exam. Let me clarify what I was ranting about in the main post:
I have managed to get the software to do what it should be doing, ie. I have worked out how to use it (ha ha)!
These all worked fine:
- The employee that goes on holiday and requires the holiday pay in advance worked a treat.
- The change in tax code also worked.
- The employee that worked differing hours per week was no problem either.
- Adding the SSP, SMP and Hol periods was easy. As too was the employee that had student loan deductions.
- The employee that joined week 5 went well.
The problems I am having are these:
- The answers show that the employee that was off sick in weeks 2 & 3 had tax adjustments, but when I ran the weekly reports there was no tax paid until the week he returned to work.
- All but 1 or 2 entries were 5p short on the NIC deductions per employee, per week. This would mean that all NIC deductions from the employees and payments from the employer would be wrong and accumulate through the coming weeks.
An ideas as to what I may have done wrong?????
Your help (or anyone elses) would be gratefully received as I would love to get through this and pass the exam, adding yet another 'string to my bow'.
Thanks again
David
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- Member PM.Dip
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Regarding the national insurance differences
Payroll manager (like most payroll software apart from Sage) works out NICs using the exact percentage method. The manual NI tables are calculated on earnings bands, rather than on the exact earnings figure, so results achieved may differ very slightly.
(Copied, pasted and slightly amended from another source as it was better at putting it into words than me).
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- Fellow PM.Dip
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Thanks for the reply Peasie.
This raises a couple of questions:
- Does this discrepency matter, will it effect the overall mark in the actual exam?
- How does one deal with NIC whereby one of the tasks is that the two directors pay using the tables method?
Thanks
David
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- Member PM.Dip
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1) Don't know - one for the ICB folks on Monday morning.
2) I think what they are asking is to calculate the Directors NI using the "alternative" method. Directors NI is normally calculated on a cumulative basis unlike normal employees where it is calculated on an individual payment each month. Directors if they want can be treated this same way and the cumulative calculation is done on the final payment in the year. In "Payroll Manager" it would just be a case of ticking the box to use the alternative scheme. That is if I have interpreted things correctly.
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- Fellow PM.Dip
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Peasie said:
“1) Don't know - one for the ICB folks on Monday morning.
2) I think what they are asking is to calculate the Directors NI using the "alternative" method. Directors NI is normally calculated on a cumulative basis unlike normal employees where it is calculated on an individual payment each month. Directors if they want can be treated this same way and the cumulative calculation is done on the final payment in the year. In "Payroll Manager" it would just be a case of ticking the box to use the alternative scheme. That is if I have interpreted things correctly.”
Thanks for your input I really appreciate it.
One thing that I have found is this:
I used the Basic PAYE Tools downloaded from HMRC and found exactly the same "problem" - their software gave me exactly the same figures as Moneysoft Payroll Manager.
So maybe I should email the ICB member services or something??
Thanks for your help so far.
David
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- Fellow PM.Dip
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I think the problem I am having has got to do with the fact that the two director's in the mock have their NIC calculated using the tables method. I cannot find anywhere in Moneysoft's software to allow for this.
Any ideas??????
Once I have cracked this I will go for the exam as I have managed to complete all the other parts of the mock without the need for a course.
David
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- Member PM.Dip
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Go to the Employee Details. Quickest way is to use the shortcut (Ctrl E).
Click on the relevent employee.
Go to the "Work" tab.
Bottom right hand side are the Directors details. Fil them in (when he/she started Directorship etc).
Click the option for "alternative scheme for calculating director's NIC"
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- Fellow PM.Dip
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Peasie said:
“Go to the Employee Details. Quickest way is to use the shortcut (Ctrl E).
Click on the relevent employee.
Go to the "Work" tab.
Bottom right hand side are the Directors details. Fil them in (when he/she started Directorship etc).
Click the option for "alternative scheme for calculating director's NIC" ”
Thanks Peasie ...
I have tried that again after your suggestion and it still does the same calculation as before, thus the P35 does not agree with the answers to the mock - it's way out.
Been in touch with Moneysoft and they say
"Our program does not use the table method, it always uses the exact percentage method (which is the HMRC's preferred calculation method)."
So others looking to use this beware.
Edited at 22 Jun 2011 01:54 PM GMT
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- Member PM.Dip
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David said:
“Peasie said:
“Go to the Employee Details. Quickest way is to use the shortcut (Ctrl E).
Click on the relevent employee.
Go to the "Work" tab.
Bottom right hand side are the Directors details. Fil them in (when he/she started Directorship etc).
Click the option for "alternative scheme for calculating director's NIC" ”
Thanks Peasie ...
I have tried that again after your suggestion and it still does the same calculation as before, thus the P35 does not agree with the answers to the mock - it's way out.
Been in touch with Moneysoft and they say
"Our program does not use the table method, it always uses the exact percentage method (which is the HMRC's preferred calculation method)."
So others looking to use this beware.
Edited at 22 Jun 2011 01:54 PM GMT”
I think there may be a misunderstanding on the terminology. Here's what Moneysoft's help file says on Directors and NI.
"Normally, a director's NIC is calculated on a cumulative annualised basis, so that (in general) no NIC is paid in the first pay periods, until the annual threshold is reached. If preferred, the Alternative Director's NIC scheme can be applied, and this treats directors in the same way as other employees, so that the NIC is paid on a period-by-period basis, but then an annualised adjustment is made in the final pay period. This setting applies for the whole year, i.e. you cannot have part the year one way and another part the other."
Maybe I'm the one that is doing the misunderstanding. I assumed by "Table method" the ICB were referring to what Moneysoft would call "Alternative Director's NIC scheme". If this is the case, Moneysoft may have misunderstood your request.
Anyone else have a view on what the ICB mean by "Table method" - is it what I have stated above or is it something completely different?
Incidentally David, your email link in your sig is wrong. The lettering that appears is correct but the actual link points to "inof" instead of "info". I tried sending an email to you but it bounced back.
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- Fellow PM.Dip
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Peasie
I am still trying to understand the 'tables method' so will let you know as soon as I do, and vice versa I hope.
I have amended the email link in my sig, thanks for pointing that out.
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- Fellow PM.Dip
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I have now managed to calculate the two directors NICs manually and agree with the answers to the mock. Peasie - you were right in the fact that on their respective employee details, they need to have the alternative method ticked. The trouble is that the mock answers are for two monthly pay periods but the software is making and end of year adjustment and I haven't managed to counteract this. Every adjustment I make, the software is counteracting me. This is where my initial problem lay. I now need to find out how to print the reports and forms for just the two months in question.
Any help would be appreciated.
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I was having the same problems using money soft and comparing it to summary sheets id printed of using sage. I posted on a different forum and a very kind person gave me the answer
"Sage gets a different answer to everyone else, up to about 5p/week or 22p/month.
This is because Sage uses the manual tables whereas everyone else (including HMRC themselves in their own calculators) uses a method called "exact percentage".
Either method is correct as long as you are consistent. HMRC recommends that software packages should use the exact percentage method but it isn't wrong to do what Sage does and duplicate the manual tables."
This was exactly what was happening with me, I have decided to stay with Sage for both my payroll and account software so at least it will be consistant.
Although now I have a problem with the P35 deduction sheet missing two employee's. Certainly keeping me on my toes.
Regards
Michelle
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