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Hi
Was wondering if anyone had any advise...
I have a client who I have been working for for 6 months now- their paperwork has expended to the point of realising they need someone in house rather than off site. I agreed with the decision and to my knowledge we parted on good terms.
I sent the final invoice for the service I have given, but they have not paid.
I called, sent letters, emails etc but have recieved only empty promises. I did ask on various occassions if the lack of payment was down to a dispute or my workmanship and was told no......
I have now passed this to a collection agency (no win, no fee!) but have been told once they have explored their avenues or collection there is not much else i can do (the amount is too small for a statutory demand). I am feeling quite fustrated at the sitution as the invoice is to the value of £510... alot of money for little old me.
Does anyone have any advise or silimar expericnes which they have resolved????
A VERY dishearted (and out of pocket) fellow bookeeeper!
Kirstey
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Personally, I would chase a client to the ends of the earth for a fifth of that, but I know plenty disagree with me. In my opinion it amounts to them stealing the food from my childrens mouths and I'd defend that at all costs.
Have a look at this site for ideas, but small claims court may be the scare they need. https://payontime.co.uk/
Kris
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- Member
- Practice Licence
- 77 posts
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When employed I previously used Yuill & Kyle. It costs just £3 plus VAT for them to send an LBA - letter before action (pre sue letter)
I have had very good results from this letter being issued. However as you have already instructed a debt collector to try and collect this debt you dont want to duplicate the work already done.
I would query exactly what they have done so far - ie have they made only telephone calls or have letters already been sent, have you been given copy of the letters?
I have had very good results from the legal letter Y&K send out. I have a sample copy of this letter and if you would like to see it drop me a line on paula2202@aol.com
The LBA charges interest to the debtor and implys they may also be liable for further collection costs. I have found that companies usually pay up rather quickly on receipt of the LBA as they do not want to incur these extra charges.
There is no obligation to go to court action stage after the LBA (7 days) has expired.
Take a look at their website
http://www.debtscotland.com/lettersform.cfm
Good luck recovering your money.
Kind Regards
Paula
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Hi Kirstey
I'm new to the forum, just passed my level 2 and got my practice licence last week (yay!), but your post peaked my interest, I have been in credit management and debt recovery for 17 years prior to recently broadening my scope to include bookkeeping, so its right down my street!
Debts are always so much harder to collect when you have no leverage over the debtor anymore. I echo both Kris and Paula; don't give up just yet..you still have options. The Better Pay website is a great resource.
It would be good to know exactly what your agency have done for you so far. Whether they have only sent dunning cycle letters that wind up in the bin of most debtors, or whether they had any meaningful conversation or communication with the debtor, there may still be hope!
You would be best placed to know if your ex-client was a prompt payer, or was it a bit of a battle each month, if they just 'won't pay' unless pushed to the edge, or if you can recall if their working capital was a little tight 6 months ago and they genuinely 'can't pay' but are burying their heads in the sand?
Its early days for me as a self employed book-keeper, so I am incredibly quiet at the moment, and would be happy to look at it for you if you want a fresh pair of eyes to see what the best next step for you is? Feel free to give me a call or email:
Kind regards
Alex
alex.nicholls@total-rm.co.uk
Edited at 22 Feb 2012 04:26 PM GMT
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- Companion Fellow PM.Dip
- Practice Licence
- 1137 posts
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Hi
if the collection agency are not going to deal with it , You take it over . I don,t know about England but in Scotland you can take them to small claims court with Statutory charges and Interest.
On the information you have provided you would win the case . I am with Kris on this one , something I learned from my mum years ago.
Firstly if you are not sure you want to go down the court route , may be try the following till they get sick of you. As far as I would be concerned you have not parted on good terms, the fact of them not paying you shows their utter contempt.
1) Send a statement by email every morning to all the directors or owners of the business. Post a Statement and copy Invoice everyweek. Call to their premises once a week .
I did this with a client , after about 3 weeks they were sick of me. Why should your other clients pay.
Why pay an agency to do it , when you can do it yourself. The minute they have a court ruling against the company or sole trader their Credit record is destroyed, most business do not let go that far, unless they have a very valid reason for not paying.
Edited at 22 Feb 2012 04:40 PM GMT
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kjmccullochsaid:
“Personally, I would chase a client to the ends of the earth for a fifth of that, but I know plenty disagree with me. In my opinion it amounts to them stealing the food from my childrens mouths and I'd defend that at all costs.
Have a look at this site for ideas, but small claims court may be the scare they need. https://payontime.co.uk/
Kris ”
Hi Kris
I totally agree - particullay as I have 3 young children and want to take them aborad this year - this money could be my deposit!
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Paula @ ICBsaid:
“
When employed I previously used Yuill & Kyle. It costs just £3 plus VAT for them to send an LBA - letter before action (pre sue letter)
I have had very good results from this letter being issued. However as you have already instructed a debt collector to try and collect this debt you dont want to duplicate the work already done.
I would query exactly what they have done so far - ie have they made only telephone calls or have letters already been sent, have you been given copy of the letters?
I have had very good results from the legal letter Y&K send out. I have a sample copy of this letter and if you would like to see it drop me a line on paula2202@aol.com
The LBA charges interest to the debtor and implys they may also be liable for further collection costs. I have found that companies usually pay up rather quickly on receipt of the LBA as they do not want to incur these extra charges.
There is no obligation to go to court action stage after the LBA (7 days) has expired.
Take a look at their website
http://www.debtscotland.com/lettersform.cfm
Good luck recovering your money.
Kind Regards
Paula
”
Hi Paula
The company I have asked to help have said their procedure is to send letter, call and then finally (the last step) send a 'field agent' to the premises.
I am not recieveing updates I have to request them but I feel in some ways (its been just over 1 full week) I am not going anywhere.. this client has owed the money since the begining of January and I feel like they are doing nothing but laughing in my face now.....
Thanks for you advise and the option of the letter - would you please send a copy??? kirstey@batemansbookkeepers.co.uk
Also do you know how much it costs to take these things to a small claims?? (if applicable?)
Thanks
kirstey
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Alex Nichollssaid:
“Hi Kirstey
I'm new to the forum, just passed my level 2 and got my practice licence last week (yay!), but your post peaked my interest, I have been in credit management and debt recovery for 17 years prior to recently broadening my scope to include bookkeeping, so its right down my street!
Debts are always so much harder to collect when you have no leverage over the debtor anymore. I echo both Kris and Paula; don't give up just yet..you still have options. The Better Pay website is a great resource.
It would be good to know exactly what your agency have done for you so far. Whether they have only sent dunning cycle letters that wind up in the bin of most debtors, or whether they had any meaningful conversation or communication with the debtor, there may still be hope!
You would be best placed to know if your ex-client was a prompt payer, or was it a bit of a battle each month, if they just 'won't pay' unless pushed to the edge, or if you can recall if their working capital was a little tight 6 months ago and they genuinely 'can't pay' but are burying their heads in the sand?
Its early days for me as a self employed book-keeper, so I am incredibly quiet at the moment, and would be happy to look at it for you if you want a fresh pair of eyes to see what the best next step for you is? Feel free to give me a call or email:
Kind regards
Alex
alex.nicholls@total-rm.co.uk
Edited at 22 Feb 2012 04:26 PM GMT”
Hi Alex
The company I have asked to help have said their procedure is to send letter, call and then finally (the last step) send a 'field agent' to the premises.
I am not recieveing updates I have to request them but I feel in some ways (its been just over 1 full week) I am not going anywhere.. this client has owed the money since the begining of January and I feel like they are doing nothing but laughing in my face now.....
The company has history when I was working for them in slow payig (although they always paid me on time!) It would seem they really dont care who they owe money too....
Also do you know how much it costs to take these things to a small claims?? (if applicable?)
All the best
Thanks
kirstey
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sarahsaid:
“Hi
if the collection agency are not going to deal with it , You take it over . I don,t know about England but in Scotland you can take them to small claims court with Statutory charges and Interest.
On the information you have provided you would win the case . I am with Kris on this one , something I learned from my mum years ago.
Firstly if you are not sure you want to go down the court route , may be try the following till they get sick of you. As far as I would be concerned you have not parted on good terms, the fact of them not paying you shows their utter contempt.
1) Send a statement by email every morning to all the directors or owners of the business. Post a Statement and copy Invoice everyweek. Call to their premises once a week .
I did this with a client , after about 3 weeks they were sick of me. Why should your other clients pay.
Why pay an agency to do it , when you can do it yourself. The minute they have a court ruling against the company or sole trader their Credit record is destroyed, most business do not let go that far, unless they have a very valid reason for not paying.
Edited at 22 Feb 2012 04:40 PM GMT”
Hi Sarah
Firstly I would like to say... I like your style. The idea of bantering the client until they pay sounds quite appealing however i have already tried the 15 calls a day with no responses or broken promises...
I guess I am aware that emails can be deleted, post be put in the bin and calls be ignored.
I feel the only real way to 'scare' these now is court but have no experience or knowledge of where to go and how to start thing (also cost!) i have been warned you can pay hundreds to go to court to only then recieve a small pounds from the client a week.... is this an option - maybe right now it is.
I do not want a repetation of someone who takes people to court easily, but i also do not want a repetation of someone who allows people to get away without paying.
I would like to see a customer do it to them and see their response.....
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ps to all
Thanks for your support, kind gestures and thoughts x
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- Member
- Practice Licence
- 77 posts
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Hi Kirstey,
I have sent you copy of the letter as requested.
Im not too sure of litigation costs. It will also depend if you are in Scotland or England.
I hope you are able to recover the debt.
Kind Regards
Paula
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Hi Kirstey
A small claim submission of £510 would cost £70, or £60 if submitted online, you may be able to recover court costs from the debtor.
As long as you don't have any specific reference to interest on late payments within your standard t's and c's and as long as you notify the debtor as part of your pre protocol action, (check with the agent you used to see if they have notified the debtor of your statutory rights), you may be eligible to charge interest, and to recover a standard debt recovery fee of £40 if deemed reasonable.
Don't forget that if your debtor still ignores the claim, you may have to pay more to enforce the judgement. Again, this should be recoverable, but worth thinking about.
You can claim online yourself via the Directgov website, it saves a fortune in solicitor or debt collector fees!
Let me know if I can help you any further.
Alex (not normally on line at this time of night, I have a restless toddler!)
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Hi Alex
I know what the late nights are ALLL about (having 3 myself!)
Apart from the matchsticks holding your eyes open I hope all is well now......
I just wanted to say thanks for the advise.. I have called the online small cliams this morning and been given (yet more advise) on how to deal.
I then called the collection company helping and feel things are now moving... they have made contact and been made a promise of payment. Not going to count the chickens just yet as this may be yet another broken promise, but at least the client knows we are on their case!!!!
Also to anyone out there who is a ICB member and thinking 'it is really worth the fee' I can honestly, hand on heart say YES!!!!! i have never really used the forum before but knowing there are people out there 'supporting' is a great feeling (particullay when you are feeling down).
Thanks to all and thanks to the ICB for connecting us!!!! x
A 'feeling brighter' Kirstey!!!!
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Hi Kirstey
All is good now - she was just full of cold and wouldn't settle. I'd love a good 8 hours sleep sometime soon though!!
Glad to hear things are looking more promising - I have my fingers crossed for you, hopefully it'll all come good in the end!
I'm loving the forum too - there is so much good advice out there, and it's nice that people are willing to share experiences, it really helps!
Let us know the outcome.
Kr's
Alex
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