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Hello,
Could someone tell me if there is any difference between Office supplies and Office stationery N/C 7504?
How about Council Tax - to be posted as Service charges 7101 or to create a new N/C maybe 7105?
Cris
Edited at 28 May 2011 09:04 PM GMT
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- Fellow PM.Dip
- Practice Licence
- 424 posts
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There is a fundamental difference between stationery and supplies.
Office stationery = paper, writing implements, etc
Office supplies = items such as paper clips, post-it notes, staples, hole punches, binders and laminators, but also encompasses higher-cost equipment like computers, printers, fax machines, photocopiers and cash registers, as well as office furniture such as cubicles, filing cabinet, and armoire desks.
Hope this clears that part of your query.
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David said:
“There is a fundamental difference between stationery and supplies.
Office stationery = paper, writing implements, etc
Office supplies = items such as paper clips, post-it notes, staples, hole punches, binders and laminators, but also encompasses higher-cost equipment like computers, printers, fax machines, photocopiers and cash registers, as well as office furniture such as cubicles, filing cabinet, and armoire desks.
Hope this clears that part of your query.”
Hi David,
Thank for your replay. It looks like they are different and need to have 2 accounts.
What's the N/C for Office supplies to use then?
And Council Tax?
Kind regards,
Cris
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- Fellow PM.Dip
- Practice Licence
- 424 posts
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Cris said:
Hi David,
Thank for your replay. It looks like they are different and need to have 2 accounts.
What's the N/C for Office supplies to use then?
And Council Tax?
Kind regards,
Cris
Hi Cris
Make a nominal code for office supplies, maybe the next in sequence to stationery as long as it is roughly in the 75xx range. Same for Council Tax, create one. As long as it's in the 71xx range. This way they have their own account to keep track of them and, more importantly, they appear on the correct reports (ie. balance sheet or p&l account).
Try reading this - Sage help on nominal codes
Hope this helps.
David
Edited at 29 May 2011 02:47 PM GMT
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Many thanks, David
I know about COA and checked it already and that's why I am so confused with some of the items to be posted into Accounts.
For example if I have to register tea, coffee and milk for office use, I will use Refresments 8205 and not new accounts for each of them, wright?
My test is to post some invoices to the purchase ledger
Supplier A:
Office supplies £8.76 do I need 2 N/C instead of just one 7504? £8.76 is not furniture,
Office stationery £11.20 computer or printer........
Supplier B:
Coffee/tea for office use £10.00
Sugar and milk for office use £4.50
Then another one that I am confused when I look into COA is where to place Student Loan Deduction from wages. Is it 2222 Salaries - accruals or 2301 Loan?
Kind regards,
Cris
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- Companion Fellow PM.Dip
- 1139 posts
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David said:
“There is a fundamental difference between stationery and supplies.
Office stationery = paper, writing implements, etc
Office supplies = items such as paper clips, post-it notes, staples, hole punches, binders and laminators, but also encompasses higher-cost equipment like computers, printers, fax machines, photocopiers and cash registers, as well as office furniture such as cubicles, filing cabinet, and armoire desks.
Hope this clears that part of your query.”
Hi Chris and David
Most companies now have a code for Office Supplies and Expenses . Which would cover stationery, Cartridges ,Tea and Coffee Supplies for the office , some Office Maintenance . It all depends how the company you are providing the accounts for want it broken down and how far . You also have to make a judgement where things should sit in your profit and loss every company is different
For example if you were a PR company cartridges could be part of cost of sale as you could be doing loads of printing, as could the paper. Or even if you are an accountants firm or bookkeeping firm you could regards these as a direct cost or a cost of sale. I only print if my clients need it and for good presentation so I get paid. Therefore is is a cost of sale and not a overhead. Another example If you are delivery firm motor costs would be a cost of sales they would not sit in overheads.
When you are producing a profit and loss for a sole trader or company it needs to be a useful tool for them. The same rules apply for SA .
"but also encompasses higher-cost equipment like computers, printers, fax machines, photocopiers and cash registers, as well as office furniture such as cubicles, filing cabinet, and armoire desks. "
David these would more likely to be capital items , and they would be under Office Equipment Additions for the year for a Ltd Company, sole trader, LLP and Capital Allowances and Depreciation would be calculated for Companies House Financial Statements , CT600 Return or your SA Return.
Hope this helps
Cris can you set the codes yourself in the CoA for the exam, because if so it is well know the Sage Nominal structure is not in great order and in the real world you would not present a set of accounts with some of those codes.
In an exam situation I would ask the ICB to clarify exactly where they want it to go to and why so you understand . When your actually doing a profit and loss for companies most want the P& L to be a useful tool the layout on sage you are using it not. But for this question I think the ICB should confirm what their position is for an exam situation.
Edited at 29 May 2011 06:34 PM GMT
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Thank you for your replay, Sarah
Now I am more confused:
Tea, coffee, milk should be posted under Office Expenses and not Refreshments?
Kind regards,
Cris
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- Companion Fellow PM.Dip
- 1139 posts
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HI Cris
Please do not get too confused, this is a judgement call in real life situation and as long as it is clear what you have purchased there is no difference to the end figure. The Tea and Coffee is for all the staff to drink and therefore could be classed as office Expenses , Office Supplies or Refreshments. So for an exam the ICB will need to advice you.
Have you been given a set of codes for your exams. If there is one for refreshments then I would use it. I just trying to explain a real life situation as normally a business would not divide it down to that detail as they want to see the main picture.
Cris if this is for a exam I would ring ICB on Tuesday and asked them to give you answer for your exam . And explain to them why you are asking.
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Hi there,
what about envelopes? Does it belongs to "Office supplies" or "office stationery"?
And stamps? I thought it belongs to "postage" but see the excerice suggested answers given as it being located under "Telex/Telegram/Facimile"?
I can fully understand Chris's confusion, I just feel the same. I am sorry I can't help answering the questions (but raise more questions ) but I hople this can be explained more clearly at the end.
thank you
Anna
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Hi Anna
Envelopes is part of the stationery costs (although it could go under paostage and packing)
Stamps are postage and packaging
The following advice is one of the ways I used to figure out where to code things........
Look up the likes of Viking Direct and check the department they have listed things under.
You can of course add your own codes as long as they are in the correct part of the trial balance.
e.g. A business may want to know exactly how much they pay out on stamps:
create a code under overheads called stamps
or they may want to know exactly how much they pay out on packaging sending out tenders:
create a code under overheads called tender packaging
The key to all of this is to make sure the amounts are going to the right section of the trial balance:
Sales
Purchases
Direct Expenses
Overheads
etc
The reason behind the seperate coding is basically so that the business can pin point expenditure. Simply calling expenses 'overheads' wouldnt allow the business to tell whether they were paying too much on hotel accomodation for sales reps for instance against the profit they could potentially make.
another example is if the business only had 2 office staff and they were spending around £500 per month on tea, coffee and milk what would you as a bookkeeper think? A bookkeeper would maybe surmise that the staff were operating their own business of selling tea and coffee but stealing the business money to do so.
Okay a bit extreme but hope that helps clear it up a little.
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Dear Liz,
Thank you very much for your response. I used Staple to guide me before I asked my question but still wasn't sure.
I think you have explained very well the reason behind and how this should have been dealt with in real life situation, which makes me more confident now as someone from the real industry confirmed what I suspected. however I think it is difficult to judge in an exam situation - what if the examer has a slightly different idea? I suppose they mark the papers by a standard given answer sheet, but not mark on every individual cases? I think it would really make sense if the examer would consider the real life situation, and not be stubborn in this case as at the end of the day the exam is to facilite students to have the ability to carry out work in real life cases.
Sorry I might worry too much but I think this is what I was not sure about.
Thank you again for your kind advice, you have been very helpful Liz
Anna
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Hi again Anna
Stop worrying - as long as it is clear that you understand the coding and reasoning for it then you will be fine I think. I think the ICB are probably one of the few (the only one Ive come across anyway) that marks papers more or less as if in a real life scenario.
If it isnt clear from the question how stamps for instance should be coded, then I would think that as long as you are entering them under the correct heading (overheads etc) then the examiner would be happy - although they would proably mark you down for being a bit too creative and putting stamps under heat & light or rent 
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REMOVED AS SPAM
Edited at 18 Jul 2011 02:18 PM GMT by James @ ICB (MODERATOR)
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Can someone please help? I need to post ICB Membership payment and practice licence payment. I'm not sure if they count as Professional fees 7603 or subscriptions 8201.
Please help?
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abmond999said:
“Can someone please help? I need to post ICB Membership payment and practice licence payment. I'm not sure if they count as Professional fees 7603 or subscriptions 8201.
Please help?”
I'd post them as professional fees, I'd consider magazine subscriptions etc as subscriptions whereas your membership dues are seen as a legal requirement in order to carry out your trade. I'm sure either are acceptable as per the office supplies / office stationery argument.
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Post Removed As Spam
Edited at 27 Jan 2012 01:55 PM GMT by James @ ICB (MODERATOR)
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I have a question related to this; should 'printing and stationery' be classed as a current asset or an expense? Also 'packing materials', expense or current asset? I'd be grateful for any advice.
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Pete.said:
“I have a question related to this; should 'printing and stationery' be classed as a current asset or an expense? Also 'packing materials', expense or current asset? I'd be grateful for any advice.”
Hi Pete,
It depends on what sort of business it is. For example, if it was a stationery business, selling all sorts of stationery supplies, then obviously the stationery would be stock and a current asset. The same goes for packing materials.
However, in general businesses then printing and stationery and packing materials would be classed as expenses.
HTH
Pauline
P.S. Having said packing materials would be classed as expenses, they could also be classed as cost of goods sold, if the business was selling goods that were packaged and transported. Hope I haven't confused you further!
Edited at 27 Jan 2012 08:50 PM GMT
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Thanks Pauline and you haven't confused me at all. From your answer, I have been able to get my head around it. I see now, that it depends on the type of business. Thanks again for you assistance.
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South West Booksaid:
“abmond999said:
“Can someone please help? I need to post ICB Membership payment and practice licence payment. I'm not sure if they count as Professional fees 7603 or subscriptions 8201.
Please help?”
I'd post them as professional fees, I'd consider magazine subscriptions etc as subscriptions whereas your membership dues are seen as a legal requirement in order to carry out your trade. I'm sure either are acceptable as per the office supplies / office stationery argument.”
Hi all
I would take different view in that I post the costs relating to my membership of the ICB to a specific ICB coding do I know how much being a member costs me (It means I can keep an weather eye on their claims re the savings you can make on ICB benefits hehehehe)
The ICB do not provide a professional service in the same way as a solicitor, Accountant, Architect, Surveyor etc so i would not code the ICB fees to professional fees (Before anyone jumps in I know Solicitors costs may also be legal fees depending on what they are charging for and Accountants fees go to Accountancy Fees)
You could use subscriptions as in effect it is an annual subsciption that you are paying to be a member of the institute.
Kind regards
Stuart
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Hi David,
First of all, I want to tell you that, I absolutely agreed with what you had mentioned in the second last post.
Really its a very nice tips about Office supplies and Office stationery.
Actually I am looking for the same information.
Thanks a lot.
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